PNBHOUSING — earnings call
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Prepared remarks
Moderator · Conference Operator
Ladies and gentlemen, good day and welcome to the PNB Housing Finance Limited Q2
Thank you very much.
We will now begin the question and answer session.
The first question is from the line of Amit Premchandani from UTI Mutual Fund.
Please go ahead.
Amit Premchandani
I just had a question on the capital raise.
That part of the outlook was still not clear in the sense there is no timeline mentioned in when will you raise capital and we expected that by calendar year 2019 you will be able to raise capital.
So, does the timeline hold and what is the amount that you are likely to raise?
Sanjaya Gupta
The amount is INR 2,000 crores which is already approved by the board.
The volatile external situation has been forcing the BRLMs, the management and the Board to keep on changing the format and I think in the timeframe of 2 to 3 weeks from now, because we really deliberated the entire day with our Board and our Stakeholder Relationship Committee we are going to come out with a firm sort of a format and not the sort of in the grey and certainly we will reach out to all of you and update you, so I would say just bear with us a little bit more.
It is actually this entire, I would say the deferment has happened because of the external environment especially for HFCs and believe you me it is our endeavor to maintain liquidity, reduce gearing, be solvent.
We are able to raise liabilities and within 15 to 20 days, I am sure that we should be hitting the street and our roadshows will commence.
We are very clear on that.
It looks that probably the inflow of capital will not happen in this calendar year but should certainly happen by February of 2020.
We had very detailed discussion with all the Board members, the two large stakeholders present on the board and it was a very empowered and I would say very focused meeting that we had today.
PNB Housing Finance Limited October 24, 2019
Amit Premchandani
What is the primary reason of the timeline changing from December 2019 to February 2020?
Sanjaya Gupta
Basically, it is that because of the external volatility, we could not go to the market or reach out to the market being an HFC and I think once, you know after Diwali we again gather and we along with our BRLMs, we should have a very firm capital raise plan and we will hit the market in another 2 to 3 weeks’ time and we are sure that we get commitments before we start doing our roadshows.
Amit Premchandani
And our earlier expectation was that it will be Preference capital, now we should expect QIP or it is still a Preference?
Sanjaya Gupta
I would still say that the format is not yet closed out but to a guy like me because we have a large FDI also which owns a large stake in the Company and FDIs cannot participate in a QIP.
I think it is going to be Rights or a combo of two things like that.
Amit Premchandani
So it may be a Rights issue also?
Sanjaya Gupta
Yes, it can be.
Amit Premchandani
And sir, on the margin front, even in this environment without growing the corporate book, which is the higher margin book, your margins are going up, how much of the core margins excluding assignment have gone up?
Sanjaya Gupta
Basically, the core spread without assignment has gone up from 198 bps for FY19 to 206 bps for H1 FY20 and I think that in quarter 3 it should climb up.
It is my estimation, don’t hold me, it is not a forward looking statement, it is just a guess of a product manager that spread should go up between 11 to 12 bps more because the full impact of the reference rates which we did change in June will take about 45-105 days to come at a portfolio level and I think we should be bang on at about 213-214 basis points without the assignment income.
Amit Premchandani
206 bps is the spread right and not margins?
Sanjaya Gupta
It is the spread, it is the yield on portfolio minus the cost of funds.
Amit Premchandani
So margin would be North of 3%?
Sanjaya Gupta
Yes, it is 316 bps.
Amit Premchandani
That would be including assignment or without assignment?
Sanjaya Gupta
Including.
Amit Premchandani
And what is the status of the 4 accounts out of the 5 one is NPA?
PNB Housing Finance Limited October 24, 2019
Sanjaya Gupta
I will give you details.
So 19% of the AUM is of Corporate book out of which CF is 12%, Corporate term loan is 4% and LRD is 3%.
The top 20 developers contribute to 62% of the book, right.
Now coming to 4 accounts; now, one is IPL Gurgaon which is an NPA of INR 111 crores and the developer deposited INR 39 crores in this quarter and that is how it came down from INR 150 crores to INR 111 crores.
The ECL provision is 37% and we continue to work with the developer and expect to resolve this account by the end of the financial year.
The second one is Supertech Gurgaon which is stage 2 and the outstanding loan amount is INR 244 crores.
The ECL provision is at 36% and we are working towards ensuring remoteness to bankruptcy in this account.
Once that is in place, the option is to get additional funds for the project and we have also taken additional collateral on an exclusive charged basis to further secure our loan.
Out of 16 towers in phase I, 8 towers are in advanced stage of construction and the civil work is 85% completed and 80% is also sold.
The third one is Ornate Mumbai.
This is stage 1.
The outstanding loan is INR 181 crores.
The ECL provision is 32%.
All approvals are now in place for additional FSI.
Due diligence is being done by Shapoorji Pallonji to be a joint venture partner.
The fourth one is Radius Group Mumbai which is in stage 2, the outstanding loan amount is INR 259 crores, ECL provisioning is of 35%.
Fresh evaluation of the project is completed, requirement of additional funds has been identified.
Work on project sites has started with focus on completing the retail commercial area which is majorly sold and has committed receivables.
He is in talks with the private equity firm and a few financial institutions to fund incremental debt requirement.
The fifth one is IREO Waterfront, which is the Ludhiana project, this is in stage 2.
Outstanding loan is INR 38 crores, the ECL provision here is small because our security cover is almost 6-7x, the developer has offered structured payment plan and paid around INR 7 crores.
We continue to work with the developer and expect to resolve this account by the end of the financial year.
We have created specialized teams of skilled professionals of various streams and faculties to monitor, measure and mitigate the increase in risk due to ongoing systemic environment.
Moderator · Conference Operator
Thank you.
The next question is from the line of Piran Engineer from Motilal Oswal Securities Limited.
Please go ahead.
Piran Engineer
I had a couple of questions, firstly what percentage of our deposits come from retail sources?
Sanjaya Gupta
86% by value.
Piran Engineer
Which means that our average ticket size is 6.5 to 7 lakhs per deposit?
Sanjaya Gupta
It is 6 to 7 lakhs.
PNB Housing Finance Limited October 24, 2019
Piran Engineer
But how are we able to get such high value deposits because our mix base?
Like Bajaj Finance’s average ticket size is probably half of that and it is similar sized book with 2 lakh depositors, INR 15,000 to 16,000 crores book?
Sanjaya Gupta
The thing is that is the customer profile and the way the brand has been positioned in the target audience and our broker and our franchise network, our relationship managers, our service standards.
You test us, on the 36th minute of your SMS coming from your bank that your account has been debited, your deposit will be there through a unichannel; whether you want it on an e-mail, you want a physical, you want at home, you want in office, you want at broker, you want in our branch.
That is the type of automation, accuracy, dedication and service orientation backs our products or our services.
We have very predictable service standards.
Piran Engineer
Secondly, why is our Opex so low this quarter?
Are there any one-offs or for example our other Opex is down from INR 54 crores the last quarter to INR 44 crores, even on a Y-o-Y basis our overall Opex is down while the book has grown, so just wanted to get a sense?
Sanjaya Gupta
One is that as we have been saying over the years that this organization has been investing a lot on infrastructure, on technology, on skilling, on people development, on expanding the team, branch network, hub creation.
Now, this is a year of consolidation, so you have started seeing the colors of our past investments and you have started seeing optimization of capacity utilization and I think we are in a state where the expense on running the Company has stabilized because frankly speaking, there is no branch which has been added.
On the technology side only, we are working on the wholesale or the corporate finance part because most of our digitization got completed.
Most of our information security initiatives got completed.
Our COPS & CPC is totally digitalized, so primarily is that whenever high growth Company takes a little pause, the incremental cost don’t add up and if you have been following these earning calls of ours, I have been again and again saying that 30% of capital expense hits you in the same financial year as a revenue expense because of rent, rates and taxes, salaries, depreciations, AMC, etc., and that is why even in the previous earnings call we used to bifurcate our Opex into steady state and for capacity building and that capacity building has actually stabilized and we are optimizing the past capacities and hence the Opex is showing its colors.
Piran Engineer
That is true, but I mean to be honest you all have been not opening branches for the last 3 to 4 quarters, but it is only in this quarter that there is a sudden dip, so I was just trying to get a sense?
Sanjaya Gupta
Just a second and that is what I keep saying, this is annuity business.
Your cost will hit you first, your incomes will come with a lag.
Even when our business, incremental disbursements have degrown by 35%, our profits are very smart because whatever buildup we did in financial year 19 has a full year impact this year and the lucky part is PNB Housing Finance Limited October 24, 2019 that we did smart business in quarter one and half of quarter 2. and in quarter 3 and quarter 4, the flow will start coming in.
Also, during the quarter, we have seen reduction in our admin and marketing cost compared to last quarter.
Piran Engineer
Let me put it this way, for every incentive that you all pay a sales employee for disbursement, do you all upfront that expense in the quarter, is it amortized?
Sanjaya Gupta
No, the incentives will always be amortized.
Upfronting will only be for the fixed salary.
The variable component of salaries will be amortized over the life cycle of the product through EIR method.
Piran Engineer
And sir, last question when you mention that the run rate of disbursements for the rest of the year will be similar to 2Q, this is assuming that you all do not raise capital?
The trajectory would pick up once you raise capital.
Sanjaya Gupta
So, let me very candid.
Today, yes we have a capital constraint, but the fact of the matter is that there has been so much of, I would say apprehension in this sector, for example, you did not pick up on that line that we have only 21% under construction properties and this is not overnight that you can bring about this change.
This change we had been bringing about ever since November 17.
When we say we were the first people to forecast that there is going to be tightening of liquidity.
Now, we could harbinger that because of the supply side, the credit flow will get constraint, so we started sort of be on the back foot even when we are doing retail under construction.
Moderator · Conference Operator
Thank you.
The next question is from the line of Nidhesh Jain from Investec.
Please go ahead.
Nidhesh Jain
Sir, firstly with the cost of funding going up and banks becoming very competitive, the spread between what the rates being offered by let us say PNB Housing or other HFCs, we have seen very sharp difference between the rates offered by SBI and some of the other players, so do we think that the competitive positioning for the Company like PNB Housing has been weakened because of this and only if market sentiments improve, we can be able to get funding at a competitive rates?
And secondly what we have also observed in the bond market that HDFC and LICHF have been able to get funding, especially recently at a quite competitive rates, so what is the conversation that you are having with bond holders and what is scaring them to give you money at a same rate or comparable rate to the likes of HDFC and LIC Housing finance?
Sanjaya Gupta
The first thing is, we have never been competing with the large public sector banks on price.
You would see that over the last 10 years, we have buy advertised any of a Loan asset product with the coupon rate.
We right price our credit and we have been doing it from day 1.
Yes, the arbitrage between our rates and the lowest rate has widened. we are not going to walk that path at all, even if my cost of funds is that low because it does not make any business sense.
The second thing is as we said, basically we have PNB Housing Finance Limited October 24, 2019 created a differentiator now demonstrated over the last 8 to 9 years that we can acquire, underwrite, deliver with dignity and manage self-employed individuals very well and there, the opportunity to price credit at our price points is still very smart.
The opportunity to earn non-fund based income is very smart.
The opportunity to cross sell, fee based products, third party products is very smart and even after the portfolio getting tested by demonetization, by GST, by the current liquidity tightening, the portfolio is best in class and if you were to see our securitized portfolio of almost INR 15,000 crores which is 36 MOB, the gross NPAs are only 19 basis points.
So that is the type of quality differentiator we bring at the right price.
So we are not the discount masters of this sector at all and we have never been and we will never be and that is the firm conviction with which this management works.
We right price our products.
So that is why when it comes to resale properties and completed properties, we have an edge with our other players.
Yes, the process of acquiring is very widely dispersed, it is rigorous, the process of delivery has to be very robust because the sale deed has to be done along with the transaction and the perfection of mortgage happens on the day the disbursement cheque is given.
It gets honored later on but the mortgage creation happens much before.
So that is about the competition, about our segment specialization, our veracity, our tenacity, our robustness, assistance, our digitalization etc., and we are very sure that with the advanced technology that we have across this Company, we are going to further optimize, utilize, I will never use the word exploit, we never exploit any resource.
So that is about it we are very confident.
And the real estate developers also like us for that because we bring in a new segment of customers to their table that you start selling properties not only to salaried people but also to self- employed people and in India, 73% of new housing gets created by self-employed people and there are only 23% penetrated, so it is a huge opportunity, there is a huge headroom to grow, so we are very confident.
We never competed even in days where our costs of funds were as low as anybody else.
We never competed with the brand names that you took, right and that is why we were able to grow because we actually resized the market for formal sector lending.
That is what we have brought to the table as a nation builder.
Now coming back to the bond market, yes there have been lot of I would say secondary market, dumping a little bit of our bonds at phenomenally high spreads.
That is market dynamics, I am not going to fall into that trap and snowball that effect and I really wish that large bond to come away today or yesterday but I am very hopeful that very marquee NCD is going to come our way for a very extended term from a large marquee brand and we are going to rub our shoulders with anybody and everybody.
Nidhesh Jain
And secondly sir, on the corporate book, there have been lot of concerns across the board, but as of now, the watchlist is that you have closed, also shrunk, there has not been any accretion to NPA, so how is the quality, do you expect this watchlist to change over a period of time, any accounts which you think may get added to that?
PNB Housing Finance Limited October 24, 2019
Sanjaya Gupta
When we manage a portfolio whether it is retail or it is corporate, there are forward flows, there are backward flows, there are stabilizations, there are normalizations, so that is the job of a annuity lender.
So yes, I would really wish that these 4 to 5 names get out and if 1 or 2 comes, so be it and in the past also when this entire fury of corporate finance was not there, it was not that there were no forward flows and there were no resolutions and there were no curing of accounts., So it is a continuous process and unfortunately this entire thing has blown out of proportion and we welcome anybody who really wants to come and talk to Deepika, our Head of Investor Relations.
We have an exhaustive list.
If it was not for the fair practice code, we were wanting to put it up the entire portfolio on our website.
Our capital market lawyers did not agree to it last evening and I was disappointed by my lawyers and my team worked very hard on those all 168 accounts.
Nidhesh Jain
And just lastly that just to add on one more question on corporate book there is a perception in the market that some of the loans have been advanced at a much lower yield and this is the perception which I have heard from some of the peers or some of the investors as well, so any comment on that?
Sanjaya Gupta
So, a lot of people say we are not right-pricing our credit.
If you go on our website, we very diligently, transparently in a truthful manner disclosed that all our construction finance loans are for Residential projects where the land has been aggregated, consolidated, converted, plans approved, RERA registered and formally launched.
So Stage-4 as we decide and if you see and if you compare the pie of under construction of Quarter 1 to Quarter 2 you will also see the pie moving and they are getting completed and these are very marquee brands.
This is a formal construction finance and that is why we can talk about the portfolio so openly, we can share everything.
94% is mass housing with marquee brands, those brands if they were to raise a bond or an NCD on their own balance sheet can probably do it at a much lower rate.
So, it would not be very kind to say that we have not right-priced our risk or our credit.
So, it can be the same developer my dear friend, but what is that construction finance loans for?
Is it for purchase of land, is it for consolidation, is it for aggregation, is it for regulatory arbitrage i.e. approvals, So it all depends that where are you entering with what brands, what is the ratings, what is your security cover, what is your debt service cover, what sort of covenants what quarterly monitoring are you doing or you are just writing a single cheque and telling the developer okay you pay after five years.
Here utilization, sales velocity, collection efficiency, operational compliances, escrow compliances, litigations everything, these are 5-6 virtues and they have 7-8 attributes, a team of 45 people work quarterly to monitor what we agreed at a time of loan sanction and what is the reality and we do this sort of analysis with our Board every six months.
So if our terms of reference are so stringent obviously we will have to shave-off a few basis points on the yields.
Nidhesh Jain
And just two more questions on the data points one is that fee income has not dropped that much versus the disbursement drop that we have seen in this quarter, so what is PNB Housing Finance Limited October 24, 2019 the reason for that and secondly the assignment income as percentage of loan assigned during the quarter has come down substantially over Q1 in this quarter?
Sanjaya Gupta
So, one is the fee income has not come down as much as the disbursements have come down A) Majority of I would say degrowth in disbursement has happened on the corporate side.
So, on the retail side the degrowth is only 11%.
So that is one reason and the second reason is that the fee income ie processing fee also gets amortized.
So, there is a forward flow from the old loans also.
So, it would not be very I would say precise to make that comment that if your loan disbursements have fallen by 32% why your fee income has not fallen.
Nidhesh Jain
Sir, assignment income as percentage of loan assigned during the quarter?
Sanjaya Gupta
That spread is not as much as Quarter 1 spread because this quarter we did more of Home loan PSL and not LAP.
Last quarter we did relatively more of LAP.
Moderator · Conference Operator
Thank you.
The next question is from the line of Abhijeet Tibrewal from ICICI Securities.
Please go ahead.
Abhijeet Tibrewal
Sir, I wanted to understand within the corporate loan book out of all the projects that you have lend to, how much of the exposure would be under moratorium now?
Sanjaya Gupta
About half the book is under moratorium, but it has moved from 67% to the current one.
Abhijeet Tibrewal
So from 67% it is down to about 50% now?
Sanjaya Gupta
Yes and even during principle moratorium period if there is a healthy cash flow than anticipated, the excess cash flow comes for principal repayment and in this first half of the year INR 233 crore got repaid during principal repayment from these accounts which were actually under principal moratorium.
There is no interest moratorium in any of our facility.
Abhijeet Tibrewal
And what is the typical tenure of this moratorium, about 12 to 15 months?
Sanjaya Gupta
Now what happens is when you acquire a construction finance account it also depends at what stage of construction you are acquiring the project.
So if the project is acquired towards let us say 50%-60% completion, the moratorium period will be shorter but if a project is acquired at a nascent stage and construction is taking let us say 30-35 months then the moratorium period will be around 30 months.
So it all depends at what stage of lifecycle of a project an account is acquired.
So, there is no fixed thumb rule that 60% of door-to-door term will be moratorium and 40% will be principal repayment it is not like that.
PNB Housing Finance Limited October 24, 2019
Abhijeet Tibrewal
And sir out of the four corporate exposure which are under your watch list I mean are they currently all under moratorium now?
Sanjaya Gupta
No, they are not.
IPL as I said they have repaid INR 39 crore, Supertech has moved to repayment, Ornate is in moratorium, Radius is in moratorium, IREO Waterfront is in principal repayment.
Abhijeet Tibrewal
Sir, during your opening comments I missed what is the retail GNPA and corporate GNPA now?
Sanjaya Gupta
So, at portfolio on balance sheet level, Retail is 0.84% and Corporate is 0.83%.
There is one basis point difference.
At a portfolio level since Corporate book is only 18%-19%, overall GNPA is 0.84%.
Abhijeet Tibrewal
And sir just one last one bit, out of total retail disbursements how much were disbursed to salaried and self-employed if you could just broadly give me that split?
Sanjaya Gupta
It would be 60% for Salaried and 40% for Self-employed.
Moderator · Conference Operator
Thank you.
The next question is from the line of Ayushi Mohta from CD Equisearch.
Please go ahead.
Ayushi Mohta
Sir, what sort of disbursements amounting to around INR 850 crores have you made to corporate in H1?
Sanjaya Gupta
These are basically construction finance loans where the projects are performing as per our stipulated guidelines and these are partly disbursed loans where the demands have come.
Ayushi Mohta
But sir why are we increasing our exposure to corporates?
Sanjaya Gupta
It is not increasing, it is my commitment to disburse these loans are already partly disbursed.
If I stop credit on the supply side these projects will never get delivered and there are so many people who are waiting for the homes.
So I would not be a good I would say creditor for the project.
So if I have 168 projects we are committed along with the developer fraternity to deliver about 73,000 units.
I cannot strangulate the ongoing projects.
Moderator · Conference Operator
Thank you.
The next question is from the line of Nischint Chawathe from Kotak Securities.
Please go ahead.
Nischint Chawathe
I just wanted to get one or two numbers, what would be a Stage-2 loans?
So, you have given Stage-1 and Stage-2 loans put together are around INR 73,700 crores I just wanted a breakup.
PNB Housing Finance Limited October 24, 2019
Sanjaya Gupta
Annually we will give this breakup, it is there in our Annual report.
Nischint Chawathe
The other thing was if I look at the incremental resource mobilization of around INR 12,000 odd crores, if you would give a broad qualitative color in terms of how much we have raised from banks, mutual funds or whatever some breakup of that?
Sanjaya Gupta
Most of it is from banks and mutual funds is basically CPs.
Banks has very smartly gone up in the beginning of the year from I think 18% to 22% plus Deposits.
NCDs have been lukewarm.
Nischint Chawathe
And the NCD issuance number on an outstanding basis if I look at the NCDs that you have, this would be largely with mutual funds or with some insurance as well?
Sanjaya Gupta
Well, they are all mixed over with provident fund, insurance companies, mutual funds, multilaterals, IFC, ADB.
Moderator · Conference Operator
Thank you.
The next question is from the line of Ronak Bohra from AUM Advisors.
Please go ahead.
Ronak Bohra
If you can provide the geographical distribution of your retail book?
Sanjaya Gupta
40 is West, 30 is South, 30 is North, North also has east
Moderator · Conference Operator
Thank you.
The next question is from the line of Mohit Mangal from CRISIL.
Please go ahead.
Mohit Mangal
So the credit cost have gone up substantially in H1 2020, so do you have any guidance for the full year 2020?
Sanjaya Gupta
I think see what happened we had one was obviously the tax reduction and our portfolio behaved very well, our spreads improved.
So, we had little bit of I would say luxury, we have provided more and it has moved to 80 basis points and I think on an annualized basis it should stabilize at about 60 basis points.
Moderator · Conference Operator
Thank you.
The next question is from the line of Subramanian Iyer from Morgan Stanley.
Please go ahead.
Subramanian Iyer
I just had a data question if you could split the income on assigned loan into gross income and expenses attributed to the pool?
Sanjaya Gupta
So unamortized expense and unamortized fee on a particular loan amount which is sold out, will get normalized and the effective interest spread will get upfronted and about 20 to 25 bps we assign as servicing cost annually..
Subramanian Iyer
So it is possible to split that INR 110 crores?
PNB Housing Finance Limited October 24, 2019
Sanjaya Gupta
Every pool will have a different dynamics because some will be self-employed let us say housing, some will be salaried housing, some will be LAP.
So there is no thumb rule that I can tell you.
Every pool has got different spreads, has got different unamortized COA, has got different unamortized upfront fee.
Subramanian Iyer
And the other question I had was also other data question if you can provide the yields by product both on a book basis and incremental basis?
Sanjaya Gupta
On book it is basically home loans are at 9.74%, LAP loans are 10.88%, construction finance is at 12.77%, LRD are at 10.36%.
Subramanian Iyer
And these are annualized yields?
Sanjaya Gupta
These are annualized yields.
Subramanian Iyer
And any sense of incremental?
Sanjaya Gupta
Incremental for Q2, I will tell you home loan is 9.54%, LAP is 10.39%, incremental CF is at 12.36% and LRD is 10.20%.
Moderator · Conference Operator
Thank you.
We take the last question which is from the line of Omkar Kulkarni an Individual Investor.
Please go ahead.
Omkar Kulkarni
When can we expect the appointment of the new chairman?
Sanjaya Gupta
Sir, that has to be approved by the Ministry of Finance.
It has been sent for their approval once that comes, he will get appointed, the NRC has already approved this appointment.
It is just a matter of I would say formality.
Omkar Kulkarni
There is a delay in capital raising because of external environment, is it like everyone knows about the significant deterioration in the Company’s market capitalization, is it more to do with that you are pushing the issue or any other external factors you are talking about here?
Sanjaya Gupta
It is more of external rather than anything to do internally.
Internally your Company is very robust as you are seeing quarter-on-quarter.
So I think that we will have to be brave, we will find a sort of a solution in another two to three weeks and we will hit the market.
Omkar Kulkarni
So that means it is nothing to do with the deterioration of the share of the Company, market capitalization?
Sanjaya Gupta
No. PNB Housing Finance Limited October 24, 2019
Omkar Kulkarni
Because ultimately you have to shell out the higher, you will get less and it will be a higher the expense to be borne?
Sanjaya Gupta
if the market cap is muted the dilution of the existing shareholders will be more.
Omkar Kulkarni
Yeah so that is what I am asking so is it more to do with that or you are pushing to do?
Sanjaya Gupta
It is nothing to do with that, the hesitation of the Board is not because of the market cap.
Moderator · Conference Operator
Thank you.
I now hand the conference over to Ms. Deepika Gupta Padhi for closing comments.
Deepika Gupta Padhi
Thank you everyone for joining us on the call.
If you have any questions unanswered, please feel free to get in touch with investor relations.
The transcript of this call will be uploaded on our website that is www.pnbhousing.com.
Thank you.
Moderator · Conference Operator
Thank you.
Ladies and Gentlemen on behalf of PNB Housing Finance Limited that concludes this conference.
Thank you for joining us and you may now disconnect your lines.